Trying to get a lower crossover frequency

[MartinFrunt]

First of all, Sorry for writing this in english, i'm Dutch but my german is not the best

I'm relatively new to BoxSim and decided to try and simulate a new project.
The idea is to make a soundbar with a B 80-8. I've already built a subwoofer from a good driver i had laying around. It's tuned to go as low as 20hz to like around 100hz.
I'm either going to get a soundbar with the B80 and a AL170 or a W100S/W130s to get a wide frequency responce.
Now i know the B80 is a fullrange driver, but i want to fill the gap between the Subwoofer and the B80's high end.

So now i loaded the 2 drivers into boxsim and just changed the values from the default saved file. But then i found the crossover frequency set way too high, around 2000hz. I kind of want it to cross over at around 500/700hz.

I looked into some options with the optimise tab, but with no luck.
Could someone help me with the crossover filter?

[Lui]

It`s easier to help if you attach the BPJ-File.

[MartinFrunt]

It`s easier to help if you attach the BPJ-File.

Yeah, did not think of that.. I have now, thanks!

[Lui]

I tried it. It`s not optimal.

[mechanic]

Why not take an existing concept? In the german magazine "Klang+Ton" a (full range) speaker was presented in two variations (ODO AL 130 in K+T 1/2013):

- B80 + AL130

- B80 + W130S

Crossover is at 400 Hz in a vented enclosure. You could reduce height and such volume, build as closed box and get where you want to safely.

[MartinFrunt]

Thanks, that looks very interesting!

I've loaded the drivers into BoxSim and tried to use their crossover design, but i get very weird results. I have no idea what i'm doing wrong..

[mechanic]

I've loaded the drivers into BoxSim and tried to use their crossover design, but i get very weird results. I have no idea what i'm doing wrong..

Possibly nothing - some drivers just refuse to be simulated properly, especially fullrange units ! Also if simulation was so easy and perfect a lot of people in the business would be out of work .

An example from a professional in loudspeaker-design (user zxlimited):

- design with BG20 in BoxSim with linear response
- measured response in pic_1
- modification of network, pic_2
- measured response with modified CR, pic_3

So decide for a driver and start testing for real ...

P.S. What may be a source for error is the resistance of the coils as not specified in the article. There you have to do a little research (maybe you have - can´t read in the JPG).

[MartinFrunt]

I watched some youtube videos en noticed some people invert the "tweeter" (the B80 in my case) and that solved the issue.

Now i changed some inductances to once that i could pick in the chart so i didn't get wrong results. Now i'm kind of happy with the responce and think this might actually work out!

What do you guys think?

[mechanic]

Looks good !

I would go for closed box though for a system with sub. You can simulate the crossover-characteristics of the AV-Receiver (HP 80Hz / 12dB ?) with options "Verstärker 1" > "aktive Filter" > "Hochpass 12 dB" > 80 Hz and Q=0,7.

[MartinFrunt]

The subwoofer is tuned very low and sounds super deep. i rather cross it at around 120hz than 150. when i make a closed box the al130/w130s starts to drop at around 170hz.

I tried it with the W130s and the receiver high pass filter. i think i'm happy with this! characteristics are almost identical to the AL130. Price difference is huge tho!

Any reasons to go with the AL130 over the W130s, apart from it's good looks?

[mechanic]

For your application the W130S should be perfect. The article mentions a higher precision of bass for the AL - which you do not need.

Just curious - what are you using as sub?

[MartinFrunt]

I've built a Dayton DCS255-4 subwoofer system.
I've found that that subwoofer producer a deeper and lower bass than my 2x W300s in 150L vented. It's just for a project, i'm looking into a similar visaton sub that goes as low and deep as the dayton, since i want to make a Visaton-only project